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post #21 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-21-2005, 09:21 PM
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What is the make/model of your car? I drove a 1991 Honda Accord until recently, and even though it needed a locking clip on the lap/shoulderbelt to hold the carseat tight, it does NOT need a locking clip for a booster seat. The belts will lock in a crash on their own. The booster seat is SUPPOSED to move with the child in the crash; the belts will hold the seat and child back just like they would an adult.

Are you sure the officer was an actual certified technician? Sometimes police officers and firefighters think they are helping and think they know what's up, when they really don't. It does happen.

Quote:
Never use locking clip on the side of the Child Safety Seat opposite of the buckle. Never use locking clip on a lap belt only. Never use locking clip with a belt-positioning booster seat.

http://www.buckleupbaby.org/locking_clips.htm
Quote:
Do not use locking clip with belt positioning booster.

http://www.smartmotorist.com/sea/sea.htm
From Graco's website:

Quote:
Question: Can I use a locking clip with the TurboBooster® car seat?

Answer: No, Graco does not recommend the use of a locking clip with the TurboBooster. The purpose of the locking clip is to convert or lock the vehicle belt to properly tighten a child restraint with a harness. The means of restraint of a belt-positioning booster is the vehicle belt system, and altering that system in any way could compromise the performance of that system.

http://www.gracobaby.com/customerser...px?catID=1#116
From Evenflo:

Quote:
NEVER use a locking clipwith a belt-positioning booster.

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:6...+booster&hl=en
From NHTSA:

Quote:
Do not use locking clip with belt positioning booster

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:A...+booster&hl=en
I'm not trying to be a smart ass or impress anyone with my (insert sarasm) vast knowledge, but this is very important safety information that you need to know.
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post #22 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-21-2005, 10:11 PM
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Some of the worst installations I ever saw where made by a firefighter or policeman trying to "help". Unless they are actually trained, odds of them knowing WTH they are doing are slim. And the NTSB does virtually nothing with carseats, NHTSA does, and even they say

But, if she wants to be a bitch, and think she's doing NOTHING wrong, then so be it I guess. Just hope she doesn't try and sue Cosco when one of her kid's gets injured because of the locking clip.

Booster seats do not come with locking clips for a reason, they are not necessary.

http://www.buckleupbaby.org/locking_clips.htm

Quote:

Locking Clips

Do you need a locking clip?

Many vehicles have lap/shoulder belts with a free-sliding latch plate, which allows the adult to sit comfortably while restrained in the automobile. To tightly secure a child restraint with a lap/shoulder belt having a free-sliding latch plate, you must use a locking clip to lock the tongue in place. This allows you to pull the lap belt tight around the child restraint. Keep the locking clip stored with the restraint at all times even if your vehicle does not require it. It may be needed to use with the child restraint in a different vehicle, such as a rental car, or one belonging to a friend.

NEVER use a locking clip with a belt-positioning booster.


Remove locking clip when belt is used for vehicle occupant.

Move the Never Use Locking Clip with a Belt Positioning Booster Seat to the end with all the Never's: Never use locking clip on the side of the Child Safety Seat opposite of the buckle. Never use locking clip on a lap belt only. Never use locking clip with a belt-positioning booster seat.
If a certified child passenger safety technician told you to use the locking clip with the booster seats, than you need to find the tech's superior, and report that dangerous advice.

BTW 90-95% of carseats are used incorrectly, so it isn't like you are alone.
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post #23 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-22-2005, 09:07 AM
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I'm blinded by your intellect. Oh please, impress me some more with your big words. But not too big, I don't understand the ones over 3 syllables. Click here to enlarge
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post #24 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-22-2005, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by MamaVonLuvMuffin
Your name is stupid and your attitude sucks.
BUT SHE JUST WANTS TO KEEP HER CHILDREN SAFE!!! EVEN THOUGH SHE COULD HARM THEM BY INCORRECTLY USING HER BOOSTERS JUST BECAUSE SHE HAS TO BE RIGHT TO PROVE THOSE DUMB BITCHES AT SYBERMOM'S WRONG!!!!!! BESIDES, YOU DON'T KNOW MORE THAN THE "INDUSTRICAL" ENGINEERS OF HER CAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT?!?!?!?!?!? I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU "THAUHT" BEFORE", BUT I BET YOU CAN UNDERSTAND IT A LOT BETTER SINCE I AM CAPITALIZING LIKE A FUCKING MANIAC AND USING LOTS OF UNNECESSARY PUNCTUATION!!!!
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post #25 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-22-2005, 11:25 AM
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Mine eyes, mine eyes!
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post #26 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-22-2005, 02:10 PM
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Ease back, bitchy. Take a deep breath and calm it.

Rethink your locking clip stance because I sincerely believe it's incorrect.

Click here to enlarge
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post #27 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-23-2005, 03:47 PM
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Bitchy uses big words... but I think that you were given misinformation bitchy.

Either way, I commend your dedication to keeping your children safe. I just wish your sources were more educated. Click here to enlarge


Click here to enlarge
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post #28 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:19 PM Thread Starter
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Nodakbabe:
Let us review your very first post to me:

Quote:
And if you need proof, read your damned owner's manual for the seats.
Oh my gosh, why, you were <gasp!> BITCHY!

Not only that, but you had the appalling arrogance to demand that words which are not in my well-read manual would magically appear just because YOU said so.

Even though I had never “met” you, had never interacted with you or disparaged you in ANY way, your FIRST choice was to be both BITCHY and INSULTING.

If you throw shit in someone’s face, it’ll come right back at you thicker, higher and faster. If you don’t want shit, then shut up or make a better choice.

(I can tell you *truly* cared about my childrens’ safety by how seriously you chose to address this topic.)

So before you DARE malign me about what a bitch I am, you’d better take a good, long, hard look in the mirror. ‘Cuz that big ol’ wad of hypocrisy you’re trying to swallow is gunna choke you, and I don’t see any smilies for the Heimlich Maneuver.
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post #29 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:20 PM Thread Starter
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To those of you who just don’t fuckin’ get it:
I go away for the weekend, and what do I find upon my return: Love Letters!
Sigh …
Since y’all seem to have completely missed the salient points, um, the important points of this entire discussion, let me recap, or review, them for you:

I posted. Got some waves. Then Thatsit sent me a perfectly delicious invitation to play. JOY! oops, I mean, “yay.”
To demonstrate that I was fun to play with, I gave her lure of sarcasm my best effort. My heart was gladdened by the fact that Harlot and Salty appreciated it. I couldn’t wait to play more.
Then Spastic Cat had that lame post. Thought is was lame then, still do. I started having second thoughts about the participants of this board - Ticked me off; however, because this is the infamous sybermoms site, I knew that I’d better be pissed correctly. Consulted the glossary, etc., and posted.
To which I was immediately and brilliantly put down by both Spastic Cat and Salty: HOT DAMN!! (uh, “yay.”) I had found Nirvana – the web bastion of Brass Vagina Mommas (there must be a better moniker than that, but I’m racing to respond to the weekend’s posts). “Callooh! Callay!” I chortled in my joy.
I was particularly gratified by Spastic Cat’s wit – and that condescending smilie was simply perfection, made even more perfect as I hadn’t seen that one yet; I actually did a happy dance. What truly wonderful and delightful playmates!
I was effusively gave Thanks in my next post, and because their replies had been so wonderful, I had to give them something equally wonderful in return. If nothing else, to at least a laugh as good as they’d given me. I actually agonized over the best smilie – SC’s had been so terrific – and sent it off in quotation marks.
Zea and I had a nice little exchange, then Nodakbabe decided to be a raving bitch.
Scatterbunny was never bitchy or derisive and sincerely gave a shit. I gave a shit that she gave a shit and responded with my information to continue the discussion. Scatter is a damn fine BVM in my opinion.
If this doesn’t elucidate the salient points, well, tough shit.
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post #30 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:21 PM Thread Starter
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Dear Scatterbunny,
Thanks for the URLs. What is very distressing and frustrating to me is that the dissemination of this information is not consistent. Big Problem.
The three places I have/would look are : NHTSB, the manufacturer, and my state patrol site. None of which mention the prohibition of using locking clips with boosters. The NHTSB URL you found is an old cache; they do not have this information on any of their current pages. Very distressing ….especially since I’ve been recently trawling for info regarding car safety for children taller than 4’9”. (the back seat doesn’t have head rest projections.)

I’m trying to recall if the seat check in which I participated was during the actual study (I reside in one of the study states) or right after. It was a very big deal, and we were grateful to have a clinic actually scheduled in our rural community. My sense is that it must have been subsequent to the study, as none of us wished to be included in that 95 percent, which means they had publicized the figures.
It could be that due to the size of the event not all the checkers were certified. Or, it could be since this was appx. four years ago, that the information within their training has been altered. I had traded cars with my mother for a year or two and it was her ’91 ford explorer with slick vinyl seats in back. (my VW did not have shoulder straps in the back seat). I “upgraded” to a 94 ford explorer, which has cloth upholstery instead of the slippery vinyl; but exactly the same, if not looser, belt system.
As I had pursued the safety information for the boosters with due diligence, indeed more than the norm in this case, I have had no reason to doubt my understanding.

Time for another call to the state patrol ….. thanks for your input, I appreciate it.

Thank you, too, Vixen and Heels. Extremely encouraging to find women who comprehend the issues at stake and endeavored to make a difference. Happy to have met the three of you.
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post #31 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:26 PM
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I'm curious why you haven't taken your righteous babe stance on all issues to the ME yet?

I noticed a few posts, but nothing as vociferous and staunch as you are here.
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post #32 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:27 PM Thread Starter
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For Munchy, MamaLVon and Fluffy:
I could care less if you hate my guts, but do you have to be so BORING doing it?

Another “sigh” … oh well, since you seem to require hugs and smoochies to assuage your fires of un-righteous indignation, here goes:

My “stupid” name appears to be, based solely on your reports, rather apropos, don’t you agree? Honesty is a bad thing here? Tisk, tisk.

As to trying to impress with big words, uh, no. Witticisms - yes; word length - no. Or are you actually trying to imply that I must censor my language on this site? All manner of expletives are allowed here, but not words over two syllables? Piffle. “I am what I am” and I don’t believe altering myself to fit your expectations is a site requirement.

And since I am forced to respond to drivel, I must particularly site Munchy. For even though you should be berated for choosing the most trivial of points to belittle in a very serious discussion, (bashing irrelevant style and not substance; in addition to confusing the honored tradition of debate and discussion with “it’s so cuz I said so” tripe), you, unfortunately, waded into the fray to become a despicable fool.

Why? Because you decided to deride my typos without ever giving thought to my sig line. I am dyslexic and have a horrendous time spelling. For most posts (that one not, obviously) I must type everything in a word doc to check my spelling, and carefully re-read to check for omitted words. My mother was an English prof, and while my father and I are both dyslexics, my entire family adores words and language and wit. I’m just grateful that computers came along and made things so much easier for me. (Aside: “thauht” was my attempt at typing dialect – I apologize for not continuing the pronunciation into the next sentence for clarity.)

Even though I clearly announced my disability, that is exactly what you chose as my horror . I repeat – you are a despicable fool.

{{{{{{{{{{{HUGS}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}} to you all.
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post #33 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:30 PM
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Don't call the state patrol, please. You really need to be consulting a Child Passenger Safety Technician. They are required to keep their training updated. Random, helpful cops and firefighters don't always get it right. They are there to help after a catastrophe as already occurred; they aren't exactly experts when it comes to child passenger safety.

So you have a '94 Explorer, that means your seatbelts are probably ELR--emergency locking retractor belts. That means that they will indeed lock in a crash, but they stay loose the rest of the time. You need a locking clip to hold a carseat tight with these belts, but you do not use a locking clip when a belt positioning booster seat is used. The booster seat should move freely, as if it is part of the child. Locking clips are only precrash positioners, used to keep a carseat tight (instead of wiggling all over the backseat during a drive) until the vehicle's ELR kicks in; the locking clip usually pops off when that happens, and the ELR holds the seat tight.

What kind of booster(s) are you using right now, and how tall are the kids using them? I know we can come up with boosters that will work with your seatbelts and lowback bench seat.
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post #34 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:31 PM
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Darlin', I don't hate you. I don't have enough energy for that IRL, let alone online.

I actually find your self-importance boring, yet vaguely amusing.

Honesty is well-appreciated here, and should you decide to venture off the safety of the WR, you'll soon see that.
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post #35 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 02:33 PM
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Find a local certified CPST here: http://www.seatcheck.org/
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post #36 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-24-2005, 03:01 PM Thread Starter
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Hey Scatterbunny,
I should have qualified my response with "a certified tech within the State Patrol". I live in a rural moated area, so the SP is the most efficient and effective source of a CT.
Thanks for the URL, I can ask for her by name now.

BTW: the seats are cosco voyagers, the older just surpassed 50 inches (which is why I've been on line checking), and is using the reg belt which still crosses too high on her neck.
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post #37 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-25-2005, 08:19 AM
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Try the Evenflo Big Kid booster instead of the Cosco Voyager. It's better padded, and adjusts the seatbelt better.

And I was not meaning to be "bitchy" It does however infuriate me to hear of techs giving out bad(and sometimes dangerous) advice.
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post #38 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-25-2005, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nodakbabe
Try the Evenflo Big Kid booster instead of the Cosco Voyager. It's better padded, and adjusts the seatbelt better.

And I was not meaning to be "bitchy" It does however infuriate me to hear of techs giving out bad(and sometimes dangerous) advice.
The Evenflo Big Kid is good, and the most basic version is about $30, so it's affordable, but it doesn't have EPS foam in the headwings like the Graco Turbo Booster does. However, it has flip-up armrests, which make it easier for kids to buckle themselves. You can get a Turbo for about $40 for the basic version (this just means it isn't as padded).

And about techs giving bad advice--for the past couple of days I've been trying to convince someone that Mighty Tites are not the greatest invention on earth, and that a MT does not replace a locking clip. According to her, a CPST told her that her installation was perfect. Click here to enlarge
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post #39 of 54 (permalink) Old 10-25-2005, 03:46 PM Thread Starter
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Hey Scatterbunny -
As I'm reviewing the Graco trubo booster, the initial disconnect about the locking clip is becoming clear. It certainly is NOT universally disseminated (which, of course, pisses me off! But there are a few points which actually re-enforced the information I was previously given. Which is the utterly distressing part.
the manual for my cosco voyagers talks about how to use the ELR belts, stating at the end "no locking clip is required." It does NOT forbid them in the least.
And while it does not mention the specifically address the "tightness" of the seat's position, if you look at page 23 of the Graco turbo booster item #7, it emphatically demands that the booster be snug to the seat back or you put your child in grave danger. (that manual also does not mention prohibiting locking clips)
Indeed, this is what I was told at the safety check -- that because the boosters could more easily lose position, I needed to use the locking clip (in my case) to better protect the child.

The locking clip shooting off during an accident is hideous, as it becomes a leathal projectile. However, you can see the quandry with my past information. (and even current information.)

I'll be very interested to hear what the CT has to say about all this, and why there is no warning on the NHTSB site.


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post #40 of 54 (permalink) Old 11-03-2005, 04:48 AM
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How many friends do you have outside the internet?

Do you call them 'fans'?

Do you stand in front of the full legnth mirror and say, 'Oh, thank you God for making me so perfect! I am truly in YOUR image!'

Are you planning on signing your children up for piano?
Will you impulsively buy them a baby grand?

What if they don't do so great in school?
Would you send them to a chain store tutor?

Would you please post on the Main Event?

Pleeeeeeeeeease???
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